Tuesday, November 23, 2010

The Big Picture: "Once Upon A Time In The Future"

41 comments:

Adam said...

Weird. I watched "In the Shadow of the Moon" last night, which reignited a boyhood passion of deep space missions. I feel this has to be a priority.

But don't worry MovieBob, Richard Branson will get us there in due time.

a.k.a.A.M.V.P said...

Easily the best one yet.

I'm rather sad to see space travel relegated to the back burner myself, though obviously not with the passion of Bob. Personally, my priorities are: endless renewable energy, space travel, world peace. Fitting, considering their logical connection: the fuel gets us into space, off the planet, making it a whole lot more peaceful.

(also, the first 4 letters in the verification code for this post are SNES. I just thought I'd share that)

Elessar said...

A very good episode. That said:

The reason it's being relegated to the "when we get to it" pile is because space travel and the research involved are EXTRAORDINARILY expensive. And we're kinda broke right now.

Don't worry, I'm sure we'll get back to it when we have money again.

Q said...

Bob, saying that you would choose a city on Mars to World Peace doesn't make you a monster, it makes you a nut.

Now, ruler of the civilization that will be on Mars, that's tempting. "Do what I say," I will say raising my golden goblet of the finest space wine to my lips, "or I'll exile you to outlands of Mars"

"But you can't do that!" the blond youth with a Bruce Campbell chin will cry, "I'm a human being, goddamn it!"

"Watch me!" Then there will be a smash cut to that one scene in "Caligula" where the criminal are buried up to their chins as they get decapitated by that big fucking machine. I look to my lovely wife, bound up in gold chains. She sneers at me. I laugh and drink from my goblet.

Then suddenly, betrayal! Poison! I fall to the floor gasping for breath. I look up trying to discover sympathy, no, only the laughing faces of the crowd. Then the blond Bruce Campbell appears, frees my wife from her chains and run off together.

Well played, Bob. I die laughing to myself.

(PS. Wow, I really am a terrible writer.)

James Vonder Haar said...

It's easy enough for me to say that this should be a priority when I have a roof over my head, food in my belly, and education in my head. Any other priorities are the result of privilege.

Lucas Neumann said...

Man, you're going so well Bob...

I get the importance of space exploration, and the need for it. I'm with you. Plus, tehre's budget for everything, everywhere, even in the third countries, we spend money on space and scientific research.
Feeding the hungry is important, but it's not the only thing going on, I don't think anybody would think any less of you because of what you said Bob.
It's a damn shame what happened to the USA space program. And World Hunger is not a problem so simple that handing a soup bowl will solve it
I was really enjoing it until the genie stuff and how crammed the fact that you were bullied in school is... kinda pathetic. Sorry Bob, but it really came as "boohh people weren't nice to me, so I wanna live in Mars"
Ahn Tap dancing christ dude, that doesn't make you a "Bad guy", just a gigantic pussy.

Love your videos, like your work, but sometimes you really need a dose of "get over yourself"

Eyes_Only said...

Let's see here:
Cities on another planet to house the excess population of Earth and actually help in establishing a new cultural base for the future?

Or a moment of peace on Earth, doomed from the moment of its implementation by the fact that humans are essentially war bound either way?

Yeah, tough choice there.

Yeah,

Lucas Neumann said...

actually, if there was peace on Earth, and not just a state of non-agression between countries, but the whole mankind working towards a better future (since we are talking about magic right?) the problems that require money would be solved (and no more spending on doomsday weapons)
And since humans have solved their selfish problems, we're making free to cruise the final frontier. And hopefully, no reality shows involved... I guess that would be the big picture
So yeah, with world peace, we could see a colony in the moon, dosen't that solves two problems with just one wish?

Although my wish would be me all over Barbara Eden's body (the 70's body anyway). Man she was hot...

john said...

+1 on this. Even assuming that the people who lecture about solving our earthbound problems first are being sincere instead of ostentatiously sanctimonious (which is rarely, though probably not never, the case,) I don't really think we can solve humanity's problems with the application of money, even space-program-caliber billions. Cutting space-program funds in order to spend money on "big problems" isn't going to make tyrants not tyrants or make people stop wanting to kill each other over some stupid fucking grudge, and it's downright stupid to pretend it will. But hey, what do I know? Maybe next time we try throwing money at a problem whose fundamental cause comes down to people being total assholes, it'll totally work. And maybe pigs will fly.

RestamSalucard said...

Well, this sure fucks over the current Dr. McNinja storyline: http://drmcninja.com/archives/comic/20p43

Joe said...

Yeah, it's all the fault of the "bleeding hearts" who want a few paltry millions to address some injustices, and not those funnelling trillions of dollars to failed bankers and military imperialism. Why does the US need bases and troops stationed in 2/3 of the world's nations again? Oh, and it's definitely not the fault of those science-rejecting, "the end times are nigh" religious fundamentalists either, right?

And the day after Chalmers Johnson died, too.

Arman said...

This is one of the most painful things I had to admit, mostly because as a child I was totally transfixed with NASA and the American Space program, but perhaps its time for it to go.

Its hard, but when one of NASA's goals becomes "Muslim Outreach" its time to say goodbye and accept that the splendor that was is now obsolete, old, and unnecessary. We are at the point where NASA is transforming into the FAA of space.

And that's not neccesarly a bad thing. The Private space program continues to demonstrate that it can do the same thing, faster, and cheaper than NASA. The American Frontier wasn't conquered by government agencies. It was conquered by individuals who decided to give up lives of comfort to makes something of themselves in dangerous and unknown territory. I see the same for Space travel.

So don't fret, the American space program isn't over. Its just not in NASA's hands anymore.

dkh said...

The frontier wasn't unknown. It was known to the people who were already living there. We just killed them. Quoth Jebediah Springfield: "The buffalo was already tame - I merely shot it!"

Edward said...

We had the Soviet Union to thank for our space program...sooo maybe if your lucky Muslim separatists will start pursuing space travel.

tyra menendez said...

Yeah, sorry, I'm with George Carlin, on this one: human beings are not ready. Imagine actually meeting an intelligent alien race, for the first time, and trying to explain female circumcision, child slavery, religious fundamentalists, and our fascination with the most retarded things. 50 years of space technology, and it's all about satellites for TV, GPS, and phones. It seems amazing, on the surface, but it's stagnated. We need new technologies in aeronautics and fuel, not just more fancy computers. Sometimes, it's better to take a step back, reexamine the whole, and work out a new paradigm.
I'd also like to see a reduction in military spending. So, no, this doesn't depress me, but the "Rocket Docket" does.

tyra menendez said...

Also, to Edward,

Muslim fundamentalists would have to admit that salt water and fresh water actually mix, first, despite the Koran saying it doesn't.
It would actually be better if the majority of the Muslim-controlled Middle East, was locked into medieval mentalities, as that's when it was progressive and inventing stuff like calculus.

David Page said...

Will you be talking about America a tad less in later videos?

this very american view point gets a bit tiresome after a while and I believe you can do much better. Like Overthinkingit.com levels.

cheers

RarestRX said...

You're ragging on the "Teabaggers" vs. your Mocha Messiah and his Party?

Tiresome.

Since the Dems didn't actually write or pass a Federal budget (the first time in 36 years since the Budget Act was passed in 1974) I can see how you'd blame the Tea Party.

*eye roll*

On the conservative forum I post on, we had plenty of threads about Orion being canceled by Obama and the Dems.

Look on the bright side, with the Republicans taking over Congress, you just might see Orion come back.

RocMegamanX said...

Hey, Bob, can you delete Tim's comment please?

Also...

@Lucas Neumann

Is it just me, or is someone gonna argue that in order for there to be peace on Earth, humans should never exist?

Arman said...

Well Edward, I think Muslim space travel will happen when the Middle East collectively stops living in the 8th century. Until then most rocket programs in the Mid East will have the final goal of completing the final solution rather than creating a space Mecca.

to Tyra,

I'm sure the aliens will have a fun time explaining their flaws to us as well. No one is sure if E.T is going to be nobler than mankind.

In addition, I think you under appreciate the advances in communication technology. They've improved the lives of everyone on the planet tremendously.

Will said...

Bob, I agree you to a scary point but I have a different theory to tell you.

I'm happy Constellation was canceled but for different reasons.
Not because of poor people or sick people, screw them (no offense). Was there still poor people and sick people when we landed on the moon? Of course! However, I'm happy Constellation was canceled because if we had gone with the program, it would have been a disaster.

America, like most of the world, is armpit deep in debt. If we had funded the project, we may have made progress. We may have gotten back to the moon. Lets just pretend we live in a fariy-land and say we got far enough for a temporary settlement on the moon.

The sheer amount of money it would take to get that far would be a righteous kick in America's debt. There is no way we could afford it, the program would possibly screw our economy even more over just as we're finally coming back, and it would force us to close down the project. I have no doubt in my mind it would be canceled prematurely.

Now, we would have NASA as a new scapegoat for the economy and the Constellation program would get a terrible rep. So, Constellation would probably scare off any attempt at anything like that for years and years.

Perhaps I'm wrong. I'll admit I haven't studied (if there are any published papers to study) the Constellation project and how they planned on funding it but I had great fear of the program. If we're going to settle on Mars, we better do it. Failure on that scale can cripple an ambition for god knows how long. It like the Avenger movie. If The Avengers fails, no studio will ever put up that much money on something so ambitious for a long time.

I mean, did you see the news coverage when NASA built a tower that they can't use now? Imagine that times a thousand.
When we move to Mars, I don't want anything in its way. I don't want the threat of a bad economy to stop it or anything. When they say their going to Mars, I want to be sure I can pack my bags.

Adam said...

It's truly a sad day when space flight starts to take a back seat to the petty gripes and a greed driven economy.

However, where money might be a legitimate concern in some regards, 'fixing' the world is not. It isn't as if the only thing keeping us from solving world hunger and sickness has been money we've been spending on space flight.

No, we have to give up Space Flight, largely, because we've spent 1.121 trillion on two wars (as of July 27, 2010) and Americans leadership can be summed up as a continuing battle between evil and stupid.

Benfea said...

I agree that space is important. As other perfectly serious scientists have pointed out, if we can manage to establish just one extrasolar self-sufficient colony, we vastly improve the survival chances of the species. I would say that's as important as more typical humanitarian concerns, and I'm as bleeding heart as a liberal gets.

Furthermore, we do not have an adequate comet/meteor defense in place. What makes this so stupid is that we know that another big one is coming; it's only a matter of time.

Are we likely to achieve either of those things in our lifetime? Not very damned likely, but what we do with our space programs here and now should be measured against whether or not they push us towards those two important long-term goals.

Having said all of that, I'm surprised that you are surprised that we're letting the space program fall to the back burner. You are old enough to understand that the only reason we put as much effort into our space program as we did was competition with the Soviets. Now that the Soviets are gone, no one gives a crap about the space program except scientists like Hawking and science wannabes like those of us posting comments on this forum. :P

Arman said...

Space flight HAS to take a back seat to the economy. I can't imagine how it couldn't. These ventures cost a HUGE amount of money. The Apollo Project for instance cost $170 billion dollars. That's not small change. It has to come from somebody. That somebody is you and me, and when you and me don't have jobs, we don't pay taxes. When we don't pay taxes the treasury shrinks.

The fact of the matter is the the 1.1 trillion dollars spent on the War on Terror over the course of a decade is a drop in the ocean compared to the massive amount of wasteful spending that the government engages in, and unlike MANY of the projects the government has its fingers in I've come to think the War on Terror was for the most part worth every penny. Most of you are going to bristle at that. So be it. War is the government's business. Giving checks to bums is not.

NASA has become bloated with bureaucracy anyway. Its either going to have to sink away, or get a major kick in the ass. I'd prefer the latter, but its like going to be the former.

Steven said...

Bob, constellation was doomed from the start. The congress critters don't care about what happens in space, they only care about well payed engineering jobs in their congressional districts. If SpaceX, United Launch Alliance (Boeing and Lockheed) or even Xcor and Virgin Galactic can pull off some sort of regular flight to low earth orbit than the whole opening up of space thing can ultimately done without relying on the wonderful aerospace engineering skills of the US Congress.

white templar said...

Old Bob suffers from the progressive demonization of private industry. Mountain Dew? Really? What airline do you fly Bob? Air Pepsi?
Broson and Elon Musk will get us to the moon at half the price and double the luxury of the leaky bucket that NASA is.

Макс said...

Oh, man!
MovieBob. I'm totaly agree with you. Even this wish with Cities on Mars. Totaly will do the same.
There Always will be some reason to delay Space exploration (poor people, stupid wars, stupid lazy people).. Always will be reason to find excuse.
PS I miss "cold war". Only without nucler bambardment. When our two great nations (and yes im from Russia) were compiting for space.
And, realy, i dont care who won. Or who will win. WE ARE ALL HUMANS! From small blue marble ball, in a great emptiness of universe.
Cheers Bob! I'm with You!

blockmangamer said...

Why is humanity so short-sighted, Bob?

Cause we're addicts.

Our addiction is instant coffee!
....and instant cocoa. Instant messaging. Instant pancakes. Instant headshots. Instant burritos. Instant text. Instant karma. Instant videos. Instant friends. Instant. Instant. Instant!

Basically an instant high. Forcing everything (simple and complex) in our lives into an oversimplified world view that doesn't require critical thinking beyond a shallow, one-step approach, or...

If I don't get in 3 seconds, you ain't worth it.

For some people, it's all about the next fix. Nothing more and that's got to change soon!

Sarge said...

I'm sorry, but did Bob, a white, heterosexual American male just say, unironically, that humanity hasn't done him any favors?

What a fucking joke. I AGREED with him up to that point, but jesus christ. Get some fucking perspective.

Jonathan said...

Following what Elessar said, getting something just into low earth orbit, let alone out into deep space, is currently CRAZY expensive. It is exponentially more expensive send an object 100 miles straight up and just let it fall back to earth than it is to take the same said object on a first class flight a quarter way around the world in a super sonic jet.

And on that front, well, nasa is working on it

Darren said...

Well that sucks :/ I guess children should stop dreaming about being astronauts now :/ Although I am pretty sure that when ever one of our enemies decides to make space travel their priority again we'll get back on track. It's what got us up there in the first place anyway :/

Lucas Neumann said...

@Sarge

Tottaly agree with you man, I was digging the show up until that moment.

The show is called "The big picture" but shows a narrow minded vision of stuff. First was to annalysis the hale story based just on that prequel game and associate it with nazism or assume that other contries don't have a nationalist spirit like North America, and now he managed to cram in the fact he suffered bullyng "or something like that" to justify choosing a house in Mars instead world peace.
Don't really care about his "whish", would do the same, but could do without the whinning "the world hasn't been kind to me". So you got bullied fatty? get in the line. That's not argument to be the "bad guy"

Smashmatt202 said...

You know, my Uncle is, or rather always wanted to be, an astronaut. And he spent nearly half his life training for space exploration. But now... What's there left for him. As much as people said you sounded like a real jackass here, I kind of sympathized with you're feelings on the matter. Especially the part where if given the choice between "world peace" and accomplishing a personal goal or dream, like colonies on Mars. Really, people LIKE to say they'd want to do the more righteous thing, but when the time comes and you're giving the choice, in reality, I don't think many people would follow through on their righteous claims.

That's just me, though.

Rarer Monsters said...

My grandfather (Rest In Peace) worked on Apollo 11 and put a man on the moon. Put a human being on something that people used to think was a magical jewel placed in the sky by the heavens and beyond our plane of existence.

What I hate about people saying space travel is an expensive hobby is they act like money spent on space travel is wasted.

You want to talk about creating jobs? How about hiring people to build, design, and work on a space shuttle. How about hire people to run businesses built around the thousands of technological achievements we've uncovered working through our space program. How about running businesses with the global telecommunications networks built on satellites in space.

I mean, we have no problem funding research when it's for defense industries which produce faulty body armor but sit secure in well lobbied for contracts; or to fund drug research for private companies who will later supress disease cures and mark up prescription costs.

Bob, everything you said was right. It pisses me off too. I'm remembering that racist Citizens United ad about China taking over because America turned it's back on traditional values: well the only real value we've abandoned is the idea that science and learning were the keys to the future.

Rarer Monsters said...

@Sarge: So, no white male has ever had a difficult life? So, when people pushed me to the ground and beat me up I should have just felt lucky that most CEOs are white males?

ivnmeyer14 said...

I love how this one thing was not addressed by anyone so here goes. The Constellation program was a failure,and not for the reasons Will stated.

Constellation had one big glaring issue. That was the Ares I. Splitting up the Orion from the Earth departure stage was a step back from the Saturn V were they launched both the crew capsule and the Earth Departure Stage from one vehicle. By splitting it up you waste more time and money, as you are forced to perform two separate launches.

I don't know about you but I think that Constellation's cancellation was a good thing. What was bad was that they didn't have a replacement set up.

Jason said...

I'm a huge proponent of human space exploration, and hopefully colonization, and I don't see the new NASA budget as a particularly bad thing. In fact I think it's a good thing.

Constellation was an uninspired, troubled program that was sucking up all the money and resources at NASA. Now they can get back to actually exploring space and the development of technology to do that with.

I think it's a good thing that space travel has advanced to the point where the trip to orbit can be viewed as just the commute and something that can be outsourced.

I think it's also good that the ISSs lifespan is being extended.

Smashmatt202 said...

I'm glad to see people sympathizing with this.

Pants said...

If we give up, the Russians win.

Come on! Lets give up NASCAR before NASA!!

Just Gavin said...

Whilst I wouldn't go so far as to say I'd pick cities on Mars over Peace on Earth, I do think it's sad the lack of progress we've made since the Moon Landings.

Advancing into Space does seem like the next step for humanity as a whole considering the vastly increasing population and the whole general evolution towards are best stuff. That and we'd be one step closer to cheaply priced readily available Jet-Packs.

Anyway, it's unfortunate, but I suppose we can remain hopeful.

travis said...

Hey Bob, you're not a "bad guy" for saying that. You're choosing the route that is in the long run more important.

Paraphrasing Carl Sagan, a civilization confined to one planet is eventually doomed to extinction, either as a result of nataural events or internal conflict. Either way, it is imperative that we move beyond a single planet soon in our future.