Thursday, July 21, 2011

"The Amazing Spider-Man" take two

I like how what was supposed to be a quick comment by moi on another blog - but got longer - about the "stop pre-judging!!!!!" response to negative reactions to the awful-looking "Spider-Man" trailer, so I'm reposting it here:

Oh ENOUGH with the "wait-and-see" comments - geez! It's not like this is someone's bootlegged out-of-context set footage, it's the official trailer! This is what the studio felt was their BEST set of selling points right now. It looks like shit, you KNOW it looks not only like shit but "like shit" in EXACTLY the same way you imagined it would when this whole asinine project started up. OWN your negative reaction - after all, the near-universal insta-revulsion for "Green Lantern" after the FIRST costume shot turned out to be wholly-predictive.

For fuck's sake, howzabout we save the "benefit of the doubt" for something "iffy-looking" that's taking an actual risk or doing something new or original; not for what is easily the most cynically-mounted, passionless, made-SOLELY-to-retain-a-licensing-contract cinematic undertaking of the 21st Century so far. Even if it turns out halfway-decent, this is the LAST movie that deserve ANYONE bending over backwards to give it a "fair shake," especially if we're just trying to avoid looking like "fanboys" who're mad that the costume is blue in the wrong places."

Egh. Exhale...


So after all the hype about all the "awesome" practical-effects jumping and swinging scenes the stunt guys were doing, and how that was going to make it soooooooooo much better than Raimi's because he used too much of the CGI Spidey... their big reveal-trailer "money shot" looks like gameplay footage from a Wii port of "Mirror's Edge?"


A. Ivan said...

And what about those of us who didn't care for the Raimi films in the first place, and are interested to see an alternative take on Spiderman regardless of its roots - possibly one populated by characters instead of caricatures and with a stab at emotional conflict that doesn't hinge on everyone involved being functionally retarded?

Not saying that this will give me that, but it looks different enough to the Raimi films to pique my interest.

Also, I like how you've dropped the "Spiderlight" angle now that it doesn't look to be anything like that. Sorry Bob, normally I'm right on your side against the bizzare hate-dom you seem to have acquired, but you seriously need to get off your high horse regarding this movie.

Dmitry said...

I am here to agree with every word you said Bob. Especially in the Mirror's Edge part.

I'll see the movie with all the good will, but I can't say I am anxious for the movie because of this trailer.

Michael Kelly said...

I honestly thought everything in the trailer was great until the shitty first person view.

Aiddon said...

It's because everyone is too gutless and wanting to be "fair" about things. The film was a bad idea from the start and the second Raimi left they should have left the franchise alone.

Sarge said...

I'm actually surprised he dropped the "Spiderlight" thing. Every high school shot just SCREAMED "Edward Cullen."

What I don't understand is why Bob is offended that anyone could be ambivalent about this movie. Do you know what giving this movie the benefit of the doubt costs me? Absolutely nothing. And I'm not fucking "lying" to myself or trying to displace my negative reaction, I just could go either way.

Bob, you really gotta pick a side here. Are you a screaming nerd-rager who doesn't give a fuck what people say and tries to point out hypocrisies of his fans on his own blog, or are you the kind of ball-less fuckwit who apologizes for calling Michael Bay a douchebag?

Reverend Allan Ironside said...

Spider-Man, Spider-Man
Looks as shitty as a garbage can
Will I see it? Listen, Bub
I'd rather drink some radioactive sludge

Chris Cesarano said...

You've never seen a trailer in the past that was a complete misrepresentation of the film? That gave the wrong idea?

Hell, I'd imagine a lot of people felt Sucker Punch wasn't as good as the trailer made it out to be.

Still, I'm willing to give it the benefit of the doubt. The first Rise of the Planet of the Apes trailer looked awful generic, but the second trailer (shown with Harry Potter) was actually better. Still don't know if I'll see it, but I'm more interested in it this time considering the new angle (which happens to be "humans are evil people and we'll get our comeuppance).

This trailer leaves a bad taste in my mouth and was a lot less interesting than I'd hoped. At the same time, every Iron Man trailer leaves a bad taste in my mouth because they STILL use the Black Sabbath song about a man that travels in time to kill everyone.

I know a trailer is supposed to represent the film, to try and get you to buy into it, but sometimes it takes a few trailers to get that across.

motyr said...

Oh God, this is really fucking awkward to read.

Sarge said...

You know what really pisses me off? Bob isn't even responding to anyone. He's creating a Straw Man argument about people who criticize him. He either has serious reading comprehension issues, or he's trying to lie to garner more fucking attention.

Listen, asshole. No one gives a shit about what you think about Spider-Man 3. No one brings it up but YOU. You're overreacting to this fucking trailer which, yes, is not a particularly well done trailer, but it's also not the fucking travesty you're pretending it is. I've seen much, much worse, and so have you, so chill your shit.

Find a cause to champion or something, because you obviously have too much rage and not enough going on.

Dave from canada said...


Are you really surprised? We've known you were going to do this since last year.

And this isn't even the first time you've had to make a special post pleading with people to stop being all mean and calling you on your bull. (while only cherry picking what points you dare actually respond to so you don't have to bother with the more difficult ones.)

If you can't deal with criticism then you are in the wrong line of work.

Dav3 said...

Sarge said, "what does it cost me..."

Well, what it costs you, and me, and fans of movies everywhere, is having to sit through countless hours of crappy movies about our favorite characters.

What Sony is handing out looks like a platefull of garbage with a few marshmallows on top and everyone is taking it and saying "Yeah, it looks like garbage, but the marshmallows might be okay." I like marshmallows too, but on top of ice-cream or chocolate or sweet potatoes, not garbage.

I think Bob is so pissed because he knows if the studios see us eat garbage once, they'll just keep on feeding us garbage.

If this movie is any kind of success, then 10 years down the road when the ASM-era has run its course, Sony will hire new actors and a new crew and call it Spectacular Spider-Man. Then 10 years after that it'll be Peter Parker: Spider-Man, and on and on, with each version getting worse and worse.

A good movie needs a soul, and nobody is going to put their heart and soul into a movie if they can half-ass everything and make just as much money because moviegoers have no standards.

Sarge said...

Dav3: You missed my point, bro. Probably because I was too angry to express it clearly.

The thing is, I'm not convinced this is going to be terrible. Bad trailer, yes, but so what? Clash of the Titans had an amazing trailer, and it was shit. Mind, I'm not saying it'll be good, I just think Bob's response is idiotic and way more about his hyperinflated EGO than his actual opinion of films. It's basically him whining that his fans are picking on him.

And I think your argument, Dav3, is a bit pessimistic. If ONE successful bad movie means NO more good movies ever -- uh, I'm pretty sure Avatar was successful, but X-Men First Class still managed to come out this year. You're severely overestimating the importance of this film.

patrick.b.healy said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Chris Cesarano said...

Bad movies being a success do have a ripple effect, and typically when a good movie makes a lot of money a lot of imitators come copying the wrong elements of it and screw it up.

I think maybe part of my thought is that, well, this movie probably isn't going to make a lot of money anyway. I don't think most modern audiences are ready to see a Spider-man reboot. In fact, I've already heard a few people say "really? Already?" in reaction.

If it sucks and is a success, well, that'll be problematic. But I more anticipate the film to do poorly enough that Sony will lose the rights and it'll go back to Marvel...though they might have to sit on it for a while. That or pull an Incredible Hulk, where it is done in a manner that can either be a reboot or a total sequel with different actors.

Hell, that should've been where Sony started off to begin with.

BS Digital Q said...

Oh look at Bob. Whine whine whine.

The further away they can get from Raimi films, the better. So far, this is on the right track. Really dislike that its another damn origin story, the POV shot, while not nearly as awful from an aesthetic perspective (Wii-quality? REALLY? Thats hyperbole of the highest magnitude), I didn't much care for it either. But otherwise, I'm looking forward to this one a lot. And I hope it does better business than the previous movies. =D

Alade said...

I thought Raimi's movies were bad because the behavior of the two leads (Maguire and Dunst) made me want to puke. Not only did they not have any chemistry whatsoever, but they went so far as to invent negative chemistry, and the characters they played were a big illogical mess. Am I the only one who seems to notice this/see it this way? And if not, how can anyone enjoy these movies despite what I just listed.

Also, the trailer doesn't seem to announce anything good. What seems to stick out the most is the casting for Gwen, Emma stone? really? In my opinion she's a good actress, but this doesn't seem to be a good role for her, at all...

Dave said...

Bob: It's NOT the "official trailer". It's the "official TEASER trailer," and the Mirror's Edge part is only a short bit toward the end, not the entire thing. While I agree that looks dodgy, we don't really see much of anything in the film to judge, so wait until a longer one comes out.

I'm surprised the CGI is the cause of your big bitch-fest, and not the Twilight-esque feel of the acting and hollow dialogue.

While these short clips don't sell me, [OBJECTIVELY SPEAKING] we still don't see enough of each scene, only quick clips here and there.

So, for the time being - and until we see more - do us all a favor, Fanboy Bob the Antithinker, and quit your bitching. It's grounded in nothing concrete and just makes you look like a fool.

machado42 said...

I don't get it, you make a strawman about "Peter Parker dancing was an apocalyptic event" just to belittle people who argument against you, and now you want to to people stopping being caling on your bullshit? That hilarious.

And about the "near-universal insta-revulsion for "Green Lantern", speak for yourself, there is a lot of people who did like the Green Lantern movie and Rotten Tomatoes score, as you once said, isn't the ultimate judge of the quality of a movie. Heck, I cleary remember when you've said that that piece of garbage "Sucker Punch" was an artistic vision when the "near-universal opinion" was that it was garbage.

But yeah, we all know you like double-standards Bob. Anyway, if you are going to play "cute" and strawman your way in this movie, then at least man up and grow a thicker skin, this whine only makes you look pathetic. I don't think I've never read a comment here complaining about you don't liking the movie, but about how you bitch about it using the same whining argument "wahh, sony just wants to keep the rights, now I'm never going to see Spiderman in the continuity jerk off that is the avergers movies"

Smashmatt202 said...

Beautiful rant, Bob. Yeah, the last part of the trailer DOES look EXACTLY like Mirror's Edge, only not as clean and impressive-looking.

Nathan said...

Y'know, it's weird. This trailer is weird. It leaves me feeling 'meh'. I'm not impressed by it. Though, after seeing the thing, I think a Spider-man game from a first person perspective would be kinda cool. I do get the feeling this movie is a train wreck. One of those movies that you don't want to see, but, you probably will anyway, just to see how bad it is.

akkuma420 said...

I really didn't care for Raimi's Spiderman, so I'm actually looking forward to this.
Personally I didn't think the trailer was half bad.
I mean really Bob, what's the harm in hoping this movie turns out good? Are we not allowed to look forward to things? Why do we always have to be bitter and hate everything? I just don't get you sometimes.
So yea, I am going to "wait and see" before I start judging, and yes I'm going to give it the "benefit of the doubt", why shouldn't I?
Also, next time you should just respond to the comments directly that piss you off or whatever, because when you make a post on your blog like this, it makes it look like your talking to everyone.

On a side note, I think the first person parkour/Mirrors Edge scene at the end of the trailer was pretty cool... It's gonna look amazing in IMAX.

Whostone said...

So, what I gather from this is - people being uneasy (for example) about Diablo Cody being called in as a writer for a remake of a beloved cult classic are stupid fanboys, but your neverending whinefest about the new Spider-Man is a-ok.

And here I sit liking both Diablo Cody and the "Mirrors Edge" part of that trailer.

Matt said...

Here's an idea, Bob, stop saying what a terrible idea it is right before you say it's a safe risk-free production? I know your blog is more about your thoughts on the industry rather than the movies they produce, what you're very clearly doing is judging the merits and demerits of a movie based on this industry backstory, that's like complaining about Nascar car's advertisements getting in the way of a good crash!

You know what else came out this week and sucked? The Dark Knight Returns trailer. It was absolutely awful. Someone without any training in MARKETING could have put that together after watching 5 romantic comedy teasers.

And even the gaul of you mentioning the Green Lantern promo material... I can't believe you stooped that low. You KNOW that's a terrible argument. People said the the exact same thing about the Watchmen... people said the exact same thing about Avatar... people said the exact same thing about fucking Heath Ledger as the Joker. You know what these three FILMS have in common? Apart for being fodder for "geek fandom" debates on the internet, very fucking little. You know what their MARKETING had in common? The more news that leaked, the worse the majority felt about it.

Does Spidey fail as a trailer? Sure. Does a failed trailer mean a failed movie? Fuck no. You should know better than to think it would.

And if you want us to stop "bending over backwards to give it a "fair shake,"" do us a favour and stop bitching about every press release or piece of promotional material that pops up. We get it, you think it's a bad idea to get some cash and retain some IP, you don't like the suit, and you think it's going to be an emotional mish-mash of Degrassi footage and Green Lantern CGI. We don't need to hear about it every time a photo from the set gets leaked. All it accomplishes is putting a bias inside your readers head that quite frankly is ill-argued and irrelevant in the grand scheme of things.

Dave from canada said...

@ Whostone

But diablo cody is affiliated with Sam Raimi. And Sam Raimi is infallible.

Silens said...


I've got issues with the ways that Bob occasionally prejudges movies (for instance, while Green Lantern was a disaster, it was at least a disaster that was modestly fun to watch), but I can accept it because he sees so many fucking movies, and that's all that jaded bitterness runs into cases like this.

On the same point, however, I'm not going to concede my initial critical impressions with this trailer. I hate that they're seemingly going with an 'Ultimate Spider-Man' feel for the story. I'm seriously peeved that Gwen Stacy is the main love interest, because nobody in Sony has the balls to try and kill her. I'm disappointed there isn't a lightness of tone or any spark of colour and energy that seem almost iconic of the Spider-Man franchise. And the special effects looking fucking TERRIBLE, so much so I honestly thought the movie trailer had cut to a video game trailer, and a bad one at that. If this is the condition of the teaser to sell the movie to the audience, it is a failure, about as bad as 'The Dark Knight Rises' teaser trailer. Say what you want about Michael Bay, but when he puts a trailer forward, he at least makes sure he includes a decent money shot - and this trailer does not have that!

I dunno, the entire project feels rushed to me, and it'll be a damn shame if they end up ruining a classic villain like the Lizard for this film. Not saying they will, but the signs aren't good.

Baconchest said...

@Silens: As far as I was aware, Bob was actually pretty excited about Green Lantern (other than some apprehension about Reynolds and the costume) but then came out disappointed.

@Bob: The post is kind of obnoxious. Yes, the trailer looks terrible. Yes, it's probably going to be a bad movie. Yes it doesn't deserve the benefit of the doubt in any way. But ranting at people for not instantly pre-judging a movie based on a trailer does seem a bit off.

Chris Cesarano said...

@Matt - Everyone doubted Heath Ledger as Joker until they released the trailer featuring, well, Heath Ledger as the Joker. Then everyone was all on board. Then Heath Ledger died and before the film even hit theaters it was the best ever.


I hate that they're seemingly going with an 'Ultimate Spider-Man' feel for the story.

As I recently started reading Ultimate Spider-Man, well, I kind of wish it had that feel. Granted I've only read the first three volumes (which adds up to first three years?), and from what I read his parents were involved with a corporation that seem to have killed them. Nothing as ridiculous as them being secret agents (though them being killed by corporate suits is still a bit zany). He doesn't angst, he just beats himself up a bit after rushing into a situation and getting his ass handed to him. He's learning to be a super hero, in other words.

Those are some examples, and truth be told I'm actually still sleepy so I can't put a more coherent argument together. But on the whole, if this film felt like Ultimate Spider-Man from the trailer, then I'd be more happy.